Diesel pooling around injectors

[Karst]

Hi Folks,

I just tried to search for this issue and all that came up was my own previous post.

How should I interpret diesel pooling around the injectors? Has it got any connection with the smoke billowing out of the exhaust when I accelerate? I've just had the copper injector seals renewed.

Transit Mk7 year 2007.

Thank you

[Altransit]

Were the injector seats reamed out when the seals were replaced? Were new clamps and bolts fitted when the injectors were re-fitted?

If not, the gases and diesel could still be leaking past the new seals

[Karst]

I don't know Altransit. I just left it to the mechanic, but I can ask him.

While the engine is running, if you take the oil filler cap off, exhaust gasses come out of it.

[knobby1]

I don't know Altransit. I just left it to the mechanic, but I can ask him.

While the engine is running, if you take the oil filler cap off, exhaust gasses come out of it.

If it's a stupid amount of gas coming out, the copper injector seals may still be leaking. All engines will have some amount of blowby from rings etc....but an excessive amount should be sorted.

Lord Knobrot

[Karst]

I don't know Altransit. I just left it to the mechanic, but I can ask him.

While the engine is running, if you take the oil filler cap off, exhaust gasses come out of it.

If it's a stupid amount of gas coming out, the copper injector seals may still be leaking. All engines will have some amount of blowby from rings etc....but an excessive amount should be sorted.

Lord Knobrot

So let me ask a stupid question - if the copper seals are leaking, would that not cause exhaust to come out past them rather than into the sump area?

The exhaust still smokes like a flipping burning tyre under higher revs.

[knobby1]

I don't know Altransit. I just left it to the mechanic, but I can ask him.

While the engine is running, if you take the oil filler cap off, exhaust gasses come out of it.

If it's a stupid amount of gas coming out, the copper injector seals may still be leaking. All engines will have some amount of blowby from rings etc....but an excessive amount should be sorted.

Lord Knobrot

So let me ask a stupid question - if the copper seals are leaking, would that not cause exhaust to come out past them rather than into the sump area?

The exhaust still smokes like a flipping burning tyre under higher revs.

If the copper seals leak the gasses end up in the rocker cover area, which is also the same area às the crankcase/sump. The gas will end up right through the entire engine.

Are you sure the smoke out the exhaust isn't actually steam..??? Could be a dying EGR cooler....are you loosing coolant at all..??

Lord Knobrot

[Karst]

Thanks Knobby.

The smoke coming out the exhaust is as black as the ace of spades. Pretty sure I'm not losing coolant, but I can double check it...

[knobby1]

Thanks Knobby.

The smoke coming out the exhaust is as black as the ace of spades. Pretty sure I'm not losing coolant, but I can double check it...

Fair enough....if the smoke is black, it won't be the EGR cooler leaking. Sounds like she's overfueling....have you had the codes read lately..??

You may need to do the learns....and possibly the SCV & PRV. Have the injectors had a leak-off test..??

Lord Knobrot

[Karst]

Well, if I understood the mechanic correctly, he read all the codes and re-learnt everything after doing the work, and did it all over again after I brought it back because the smoking was just as bad.

An injector leak-off test? That's another question for him I will add to the list...

[knobby1]

Well, if I understood the mechanic correctly, he read all the codes and re-learnt everything after doing the work, and did it all over again after I brought it back because the smoking was just as bad.

An injector leak-off test? That's another question for him I will add to the list...

If the learns were "completed successfully", it shouldn't be smoking, maybe a small amount under full throttle and full load....but not stupid amounts of smoke.

I'd certainly be asking the question. Maybe you should get a modified ELM-327 and Forscan....and do it yourself, then you'll know it's been done....will pay for itself in just one use.

Lord Knobrot

[Karst]

If the learns were "completed successfully", it shouldn't be smoking, maybe a small amount under full throttle and full load....but not stupid amounts of smoke.

I'd certainly be asking the question. Maybe you should get a modified ELM-327 and Forscan....and do it yourself, then you'll know it's been done....will pay for itself in just one use.

Lord Knobrot

I've got all the gubbins to do the Forescan plug in thing. Kind of dreading it a bit though.

The mechanic said he did all he could, but the only explanation for the final results exhaustwise is a faulty piston ring allowing pressure to escape causing improperly burnt diesel to come billowing out of the exhaust.

How does that sound?

I accepted that and am now looking for a new van.

I was just a bit perturbed to see the diesel still pooling at the injectors as I thought the new copper seals would stop that. But I know nothing.

[knobby1]

Pooling diesel may just be poorly leakback O-rings or a leaking injector feed line/connectors.

If your mechanic said he "did all he could" ....this kinda points to an unsuccessful learns process. The learns are easy to do with Forscan, much easier than using IDS too.

Bad rings, while not impossible, are rare on these engines.....some go for 300k miles plus without issue. Bad rings don't usually cause black smoke, blue smoke due to burning oil is more likely with bad rings.

Lord Knobrot

[Karst]

Pooling diesel may just be poorly leakback O-rings or a leaking injector feed line/connectors.

If you mechanic said he "did all he could" ....this kinda points to an unsuccessful learns process. The learns are easy to do with Forscan, much easier than using IDS too.

Bad rings, while not impossible, are rare on these engines.....some go for 300k miles plus without issue. Bad rings don't usually cause black smoke, blue smoke due to burning oil is more likely with bad rings.

Lord Knobrot

Thank you Knobby, I am so confused now. I have had such a sh*t year this year being conned with this van then trying to get it sorted out I just have absolutely no idea who I should listen to. One local van mechanic said if you change the copper washers you always HAVE to change the rubber seals because they always fall apart when you take the copper washers out. Then this one says no it's not true and for £300 less he can do just the copper washers.

If I'm being really strict I would say the smoke is more like blue-black.

Honestly, I'm about at my wits end. This most recent mechanic said the diagnosis was a damaged piston ring. Which is "not really effectively fixable".

The weirdest thing about this is that the engine is still really pokey - if anything even more than before. It pulls amazingly well, at the same time as smoking amazingly well.

[knobby1]

If she's "still really pokey"....I'd suggest the rings are probably still good, poorly rings will often cause low compression and hence low power. If you have bad rings on one cylinder, it would possibly show up as a slight miss at idle due to the lower compression on that cylinder.

I still believe you have a fueling issue. A leak-off test will give you a general idea of injector condition. Ford specify 25-40ml per injector over a 4 minute period at idle.

Lord Knobrot

[andz327]

The diesel pooling around the injectors will be the little green O-rings seals on the leak off pipes, the damage easily if not carefull, only use Ford genuine ones (about £5) as I've used new ones from a seal and washer kit before and were poor fitting and p!ssed fuel and hard to put pipes back on, smoke wise its more likely to be a faulty injector rather than piston if it still drives good power wise

ANDZ